citizendamian | ExtSec Patrol log

Did you know? It's against protocols to do an hour by hour log of your work in a public media?

Supposedly it makes it easy to track your location, and does not make slackers work harder. Public media, mind you.

Well, the fog's a soup, it's raining off the cold pipes above, and I've got some time to spare. Protests happening about the air return system in about an hour or so, and I'm peacekeeping at it. Anyone want to talk until then?

Edited to add:

Wow, the entire square is already filling up.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

From:

citizenmoore

I'll be working the usual spots. We did a vaccine drive. Went pretty good. Miners admitted to being a little sad that we ran out of the silly colored stickers after a while.

Cafe is cabbage stew with beets, the good bread with butter, and dubious sardines flavored with chile flakes. Tempted to get some of the stew, since I, unlike the restaurant, have sour cream at home.

From:

citizendamian

The good bread? Now that stuff would almost be worth going down there. I bought a half loaf a few days back and broiled it with butter and sugar at a ridiculously late hour. Not really much of a dinner, but I did follow it by eating up some tinned soup from the cupboard.

I'm trying.

Mother still thinks I should move back with her.

From:

citizenmoore

My mother would welcome you if you moved in with her. If you can say no to mine, you can say no to yours.

Water prices went up again at the company store. I hope you filled your tank at home already.

From:

thechief

Against protocols but strictly illegal or just discouraged? I'm not saying get yourself fired or encouraging any civil disobedience unless you WANT to do that sort of thing, but, forgive me asking the question. It would make for a fantastic headline.

Peacekeeping, hmm? And would you consent, maybe, to an interview about that at another date?

From:

citizendamian

Quoting chapter and verse "A time delineated log of your work easily found on public media is grounds for a reprimand or action as needed to correct the behavior. Qualifying factors include written orders from your supervisor or IntSec mandated calming logs to show your efforts to correct a code four or higher situation."

Frankly I'm not certain my supervisor remembers all of these rules. His supervisor might. He was around for the last time these got revised.

Are you planning on using this interview in Lorena Station printed media? Or is this for something else?

From:

thechief

Right now, we're off the record, naturally. I'll print nothing that hasn't overtly been okayed. I don't want to be the reason you're arrested or fired or...anything else. I'm hoping to publish in Paris. An account following the corruption in the wider world and how a people rose to fight it, if you will. We could use that inspiration ourselves here.

And to help, if I can, in Lorena. I...don't misunderstand my priorities as belonging to my planet alone. I do want to do what I can to help others. I'm unsure of where the proper boundaries ARE. People have said that before when I've gotten involved, tried to speak where it wasn't my place. I don't want to be the one to save anyone, but to chronicle how you save yourselves, if you wish to do it, which....it does seem obvious, to learn about how it's been done, and to share that story with those who could provide outside resources and support.

From:

citizendamian

Ah well, if limiting what ExtSec men say sounds that bad, it doesn't seem terrible to put it up. It's facts after all, and it's perspective which decides how intolerable stuff is. Like the weather. Some people's summers are balmy, and for other people, horrible.

But ... I suppose I could talk, off the record. Might be interesting to hear about Paris. I wonder if it's old Earth Paris or one of the colonies. I visited Paris IV once, a while back. It was a lovely town. I particularly liked this gallery that had a lot of pictures of sunsets on various things. Atmospheric conditions still is amazing if you're from a space station.

Edited Date: 2016-05-14 02:25 am (UTC)

From:

thechief

I would really appreciate that. It's the sort of thing, I don't know exactly but I'm drawn there, if it makes sense? To things like your causes, seeing that people are helped, all of that. I still think that our future lies in banding together, all of us, as one greater republic.

If we had our own... Do you know Rousseau, from old Earth? He proposed that we're bound together by a social knot made up of our own needs and our desires to see that all have those needs met. I believe that it is true. That we ARE very much brought into life with such abilities, and we need to function in light of that...

At any rate, a people, any people, taking charge of their own fates are proof of that. That mutual need and care that obligates us to each other...I see the proof in places like Lorena and I would hope that we can have the same someday.

Paris IV, yes, sorry. I...haven't looked much at the art here. I'm from along the coast, outside the city, myself, but live there now. I haven't seen the place you mention, but there are some fantastically beautiful libraries. Amazing ceilings and windows to begin with...

From:

citizendamian

Haa - you want to get into philosophy. Are you sure?

Well, have you heard of alterity? The concept of facing a person and recognizing that while they are a person, like you, they also posses the alter which is to say an otherness in experience, be it gender, race, class, or ethnicity.

Gayatri Chakravorty Spivak argued that there was an individual right to an experience of history and historical behaviors. That your alterity meant that your experience of history, and another person's experience of history were both valid, and that it was important to recognize the commonality and the alterity of them. Versus, you know, the history is written by the victors concept. As soon as you lose alterity, you lose the space to define an identity, and your ability to reject the definitions another person creates for you.

In the lost of alterity, the person becomes worthless, because they are as valuable as the next person.

So - taking charge of the future, perhaps, but at the same time, I'm just an ExtSec officer. Nothing more.

From:

thechief

I would welcome it. My own thoughts and experience only allow for so much after all. Perspectives on what I have missed or may be lacking in consideration help me greatly after all.

I would suggest that we need not be on mutually exclusive terms with regard to the question of a social contract amongst all of us all the same. Within the framework, it IS possible to provide for each according to his needs, and certainly, to recognize the value and the differences between us. We might learn from each other, even as we come together.

Consider it as...The ancient Greeks had their meeting place, their democracy, as limited as it was. One central experience, perhaps, but many other smaller, minor versions of alterity amongst them as to whether a man may be a doctor, or a soldier, or a businessman or scholar. And yet they came together, made all voices heard, and cast their votes.

Can democracy not function in the same way, with respect towards that alterity that you and I both share? I would not presume to think that we are quite the same, but that there are still things all men deserve regardless of what makes them different. When it comes to those things, to food, and care when they are ill, education, and a voice and the means to speak up and be heard, those are places that we should be equal. When we speak, of course, considering the value of words and experiences come to play, but the chances...we must all be subservient and dependent on all others, and what they have known. It is the only way that we can hold our ties to each other tight, and cling to the knowledge that we all support each other, that we pull together and respect even those whose votes do not become majority. Protection even for those who disagree, and care and a voice for all.

I fail to see those concepts negating much.

And is that all? I doubt it very much, monsieur.

From:

citizendamian

It seems to me that the silenced are a clear and present danger. I can stand in the agora and hear the voices, of course, but what of the ones who can't go to the agora?

The Stoics have the first recorded condemnation of slavery, and the average Athenian had at least one slave.

Tell me about the library? All the ones here have no windows, since the sun would ruin the books in time, even with the tinted windows. I've seen some on planets that had these huge stained glass windows, which were beautiful.

From:

thechief

A clear and present danger, yes. That is why it becomes so very, very important that the system has a way to reach all corners of the world. THAT is what I believe can be done, if we might find the way. Technology has paved much of that. If we look upon what science has given us in general...the fact we are able to speak, ourselves, and have this debate despite the fact we are so very far apart speaks volumes.

It is wrong that any will be silenced. Perhaps there will always be those who DO it, but there are also those who would seek to ensure that they are heard, who would take the risk. I would say that men of that sort always do arise. One of my best friends, he holds that men are naturally good, that society and other factors and harsh treatment can make them bad. If that is the case, we are naturally drawn toward each other, no?

I would say that we send people to the agora, to ensure that they are at least heard. A risky proposition and a lofty one, I know, but what is a universal peace and freedom but the work of years and sacrifice? I suspect we can but pave the way, but we can do well in paving it all the same, where we can. In that comes revealing truths that may not be best welcomed, and repairing our own wrongs where we find them.

That they do, for they were as corrupt as any. Slavery in any form is an abhorance, but such ideas as theirs...they can be built upon, improved, as a sort of blueprint for the foundation of what's to come.

But, yes, the libraries. My favorite room in our school's has windows clear to the ceiling, more like a conservatory in part, but used for studying and writing. One can overlook a fountain and a statue of La Marianne herself...a symbol of Old Paris, near a goddess in and of herself now. There are some rooms with that glass as well, though they're mostly used for studying in small groups, or working on projects together. And a few of the classrooms in the law school itself, those that are not lecture halls, of course.

None so fine as our replica Notre Dame Cathedral boasts, of course, but well, who goes there, these days? I've a hard time finding religious men amongst many in Paris, though I haven't been looking very hard.

From:

citizendamian

The system?

My family, ages ago, were farmers in rural Russia. If you arrived, talking of freedom of speech, they'd probably listen. I doubt though, that they'd care about Greece, or agoras, or democracy in the Athenian ideal.

My dad said the story was they heard about the Tunguska event and decided to move toward bigger cities. Of course, I looked it up, because that sounded interesting. Other than one distant relative that died out in Siberia, there was no way they could've been anywhere near that.

And yet, that's a history, we farmed, once, potatoes in Russia, and thought the world was ending. And then we ended up in space.

False, of course, but still -

Religion! Now there's something I don't touch. My best friend of all my years is Buddhist, and my family was Russian Orthodox, once. Politics in theory seems safe, but a man and their god seems a dangerous place.

From:

thechief

Whatever system of governance is in place. I propose that one involve many people making choices instead of one, or of leaders chosen by the people, as in the American colonies and Americas in general. We've a king and it...is not a good way to function.

And there is no wrong in considering other ideals as well, where those exist.

Russian...you've quite a history of revolts there as well, and a foundation with some rather interesting thought behind it and ideas to improve and help many people. I do not mean to be exclusive, please forgive me that.

But in any rate, an ideal that would allow for representation, is what I suppose I drive at. One created by all of the people all together. Why not bits of what made each nation and each people great and strong in their day? Is there a wrong in that?

And so it is. A history you came from, at least in terms of how it has informed the person you've become. Fishing charters for my family, then shipping, then importing into business and a life along the ocean but different from my friends in similar places. My own village is unique in all our world, as is what I experienced there.

What I propose cannot be, of course, without that work of many, and without ensuring, as you point out, that those of many, every, place are considered and become part of it, that in compromise and willingness to work, the future can be brighter, golden, even. And if it is not perfect, is a step closer not enough?

I'd dare to venture France is worthy of completing what Greece began, but that IS too narrow minded, clearly as I see it in my own mind's eye. Too many more are needed, but with even a few, things can keep going, we can keep learning from each other, helping, and... Well. Again, I grow far too specific. In any case, Lorena is the issue at the present moment, and I've taken us far off track.

Most of us here were raised Catholics, a few have stayed, a few drifted to other paths, the rest of us...exist in some odd sort of limbo I suppose. But I can hardly have a god, any god, before my republic. I would not know where to start.

...It's been good speaking with you. I understand I am missing much of your points, likely, and apologize. Perhaps we may soon speak in person. I'll try to contain myself there. I'm not nearly so verbose in public, I assure you.